Joined: May 25, 2007 Posts: 185 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:01 am Post subject:
My LM324 based ADSR (see above) should work on 6V, but you may need to tweak a few resistor values. You possibly should look at swapping the LM324 for a low voltage version - especially if you want to run it on 5V. LMV324 would be ideal for 5V operation, but it is only available surface mount - not sure how you feel about that. There are other options, but you will need to shop around to get something through-hole.
To run it on 6V you need to create a -3V / 0V / +3V situation with a voltage divider or whatever.
Thanks very much for the very fast reply.
Well, so basicly it can work also on 5-6 V supply. The voltage divider is necessary also in the case of 5V? Is the dual voltage (for example -3,0,3V) really needed (because the chip shop also work on single voltage)?
When running from the default 9V, how big is the output of this circuit ? Is it giving 0-5V on the OUTPUT or how much (I will not want to burn out the VC AMP).
Joined: May 25, 2007 Posts: 185 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:30 am Post subject:
Yep - everywhere in the circuit where it says 0V needs to be connected to a reference voltage halfway between the +ve and -ve supplies.
On 6V (ie +/-3V) supplies (if using LM324) you should tune the resistor values so that the output goes from 0V up to about 1V and then settles back to 0V. On 5V (+/-2.5V) you should tune it for slightly less than 1V.
If you need more than 1V out of it you will need to look at special low voltage capable op-amps like the LMV324 mentioned above.
I've been breadboarding the neat AD/AR circuit by Ian Fritz mentioned in the first page of this thread, trying out various things in the back to back diode arrangement in the feedback loop of a2 (the area of the 'truncate' switch), and thought I'd share my findings. Different diodes do have an effect on the envelope, though not very strong.
In fact, the circuit works with no diodes at all- just a wire from opamp output to - input. That gives the longest attack and decay times for any settings of the attack and decay pots. Using 1N4148's shortens the times somewhat, and using LED's makes them even shorter. Here's some screenshots from audacity showing the envelopes for various settings.
First is with min Attack and max decay. You can see using the LED's makes the decay tail off sooner. Next is with maximum attack and min decay. And finally, both Attack and Decay set to only just above minimum. You can see the LED is punchier, and hear it on the attached mp3 (this just is LP filtered white noise). (I used a 100k Attack pot and 1MEG Decay).
I'm building a hex version of this, with two of each flavour.
Joined: Oct 30, 2011 Posts: 35 Location: Iceland, Reykjavik
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 3:27 am Post subject:
i just made Nicolas ADSR on a vero after breadboarding it,
im loving your simple circuits i think i´ll end up building them all.
it seems to be working but i just noticed that when i had a fast attack, short decay, the sustain in zero(no sustain) and the release in zero(no release) i get this sustaining voltage but when i increase the release just a bit it goes away.
i used 470k on the 3rd opamp on the lm354 as Fonik did and added the led driver.
im using 1m pot for attack 10k sustain 470k for decay and release
also i have a ne5532 opamp on the output for some boosting if needed and inverted Envelope output.
does anyone know what might be the problem with the release ?
i thought it might be some faulty pot so i tried also using a 1m pot on the release but it was still the same,
thanks
kind regards Fridfinnur
Joined: May 04, 2007 Posts: 1734 Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 2:45 pm Post subject:
prgdeltablues wrote:
In fact, the circuit works with no diodes at all- just a wire from opamp output to - input. That gives the longest attack and decay times for any settings of the attack and decay pots. Using 1N4148's shortens the times somewhat, and using LED's makes them even shorter. Here's some screenshots from audacity showing the envelopes for various settings.
Good work. The main effect of the diodes has to do with the shape of the decay curve. With no diodes there is a long, non-expo tail due to the diode resistance increasing as the voltage drop across it decreases. With the two identical diodes, this effect is compensated, ie the decay is exponential all the way. I'm not sure about using the LEDS -- it might give a somewhat truncated decay.
Joined: Jun 26, 2009 Posts: 226 Location: The Darkside
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 6:39 pm Post subject:
Taking a look at Fonik's schem for the woollastonadsr I noticed there are Ferrite beads on the power supply.
Are those absolutly necessary?
Could those be left out??
Joined: Feb 24, 2010 Posts: 6 Location: Bombay, India
Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2016 2:19 am Post subject:
nicolas3141 wrote:
My LM324 based ADSR (see above) should work on 6V, but you may need to tweak a few resistor values. You possibly should look at swapping the LM324 for a low voltage version - especially if you want to run it on 5V. LMV324 would be ideal for 5V operation, but it is only available surface mount - not sure how you feel about that. There are other options, but you will need to shop around to get something through-hole.
To run it on 6V you need to create a -3V / 0V / +3V situation with a voltage divider or whatever.
Cheers,
Nicolas
I'm trying to design a version off this running off +12V, using an opamp buffered VREF to provide for a low impedance virtual ground at 6V. would this work (to any extent at all?).
thanks! with some luck i will test it over the next couple of days and have some results to speak of...
It will be available as a PCB, PCB+Panel, full kit, or pre-assembled.
There's a mailing list there if you want to be notified. We're sending the PCBs off for mass manufacture next Monday. _________________ Experimental and modular music at: https://soundcloud.com/she-suburban-heroin-electronics
I make Eurorack DIY Kits (pcb and or panels also available): aisynthesis.com
Is there any better cleaning effect with Colgate tooth brush? Should i switch from Dr.Best to colgate to get my boards cleaner?
I'm afraid i can't trust the promises from the advertising anymore... _________________ https://soundcloud.com/bastian-j
Joined: Dec 17, 2012 Posts: 40 Location: Portland, OR
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 3:24 pm Post subject:
Finally!
Our AI003 Looping ADSR is now available. While the company is primarily aimed at teaching DIY, we DO sell built modules as well with a limited 1 year warranty (but you can get it as a PCB, PCB+Panel, or Full Kit too).
It's a really cool (and surprisingly simple) design we adapted from the wonderful Nicolas (with his permission of course).
Using only two analog ICs, and some clever diode switching, you get an ADSR or a variable waveshape Saw-Tri-Ramp LFO.
The panel was designed by Grayscale, uses no wiring, and, as with all of our modules, there is a full video how-to build guide if you go DIY.
Joined: Jan 31, 2018 Posts: 68 Location: Los Angeles
Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:26 pm Post subject:
nicolas3141 wrote:
And for anyone interested in breadboarding or building on stripboard, here is my stripboard layout. Be aware that two diodes and several resistors are not on the board, but instead hang off the back of the pots and sockets on the front panel. Let me know if you need help with the panel wiring side of things, but I have not diagrammed that at this stage.
Cheers,
Nicolas
Thank you for all your beautiful little builds to help everyone dive in synthesis
Does anyone have a picture or a better layout for the potentiometers wiring? That would be so helpful.
Hey, I just stripboarded Matthias' redrawn/ modified schematic of Nicolas' ADSR in theory (I already took a closer look at it but AI selling those made me finally decide to give it my own try) to build it for my newly reanimated eurorack tomorrow. I know it's intended for 15V but I also know in cases of non critical modules as EGs this won't matter that much. I did NOT include the extra caps for power stabilty but I think these can be left out if the PS is quite stable anyway, right? I have just built an active mixer which just works like a charm and without noise without any extra caps and stuff. Anyway: do you see anything that doesn't look right in my stripboard layout?
Thanks in advance! Nicolas designs are killer, btw.!
Nicolas ADSR.png
Description:
Filesize:
240.1 KB
Viewed:
812 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.
The knobs from left to right are ADSR. When Attack is fully ccw the LED lights up constantly, the more it is turned cw the less bright it gets. Attack kind of works but Decay doesn‘t seem to change anything so does Sustain do - no changes. Release kind of acts normal as well but overall the behaviour is pretty strange:
The overall amplitude of the signal is far too small - I haven‘t measured voltages but the change in parameters e.g. cutoff of a Doepfer a-121-2 or the pitch of the Doepfer VCO is way to small. As mentioned, the LED behaves strange as well - it seems to be dependant on the Attack parameter.
Another things that’s strange is that it doesn‘t seem to go to zero and that the LED is constantly lit even when theres no gate present nor the LFO switch activated.
The LFO switch doesn‘t work properly as well. In the video everything is triggered with a simple manual gate.
The Module runs on 0-12V, -12 is not connected (as in the schematic). The schematic by Matthias is intended for +-15V but I supposed this wouldn‘t matter at all. Maybe it does?
Below are some pictures of the build attached, maybe it helps. Thanks everybody! I have grown mature enough to finally invest enough patience and time into SDIY so that I‘m looking forward to actively participating in the forums from now on in contrast to lurking around for more than a decade and not really contributing anything to the community, btw....
D0A46A62-A80A-4C8F-9ECF-245F2DC0B245.jpeg
Description:
Filesize:
1.38 MB
Viewed:
337 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.
62F88EA5-ADD8-4F67-9B98-BC47A7A84D13.jpeg
Description:
Filesize:
1.37 MB
Viewed:
408 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.
1CA1B467-BC70-4317-ABCF-FA24754E3AAF.jpeg
Description:
Filesize:
1.34 MB
Viewed:
398 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.
Okay, sorry for the spam - it didn't stop bothering me...from fonik's redrawn schem I assumed the negative pin of the LM324N would need to be connected to GND/0V but comparing it to Nicola's original design I suspect one of my mistakes was not to connect it to -V but to GND instead, right? I will give it another try later on and post my results....
Cheers!
UPDATE: soldering negative power of the LM324 to -V instead of ground significantly improved the overall performance. Nevertheless the behaviour is not as I would expect from an ADSR. Has anybody had success transfering the values to eurorack-level? I will try to change some resistor values and see if there‘s a difference this week...but some other projects hve also arrived from the UK soooooo they probably will come first.
PERFORMANCE did u end up getting this working with + / - 12v?
ive been toying with this circuit for a few days, trying to get it to work with 12v.
i feel like im close but its not quite there.
my symptoms may be sort of similar to you experience?
the lfo / trigger switch does not work at all :S
most of the pots work as they should, however if i turn the release pot up over about 30% the gate is always open.
i did find an interesting way to modify the attack time by putting the 10uf on a switch with some other cap values (as low as 100nf and as high as 100uf for SUPER slow attack)
PERFORMANCE wrote:
Okay, sorry for the spam - it didn't stop bothering me...from fonik's redrawn schem I assumed the negative pin of the LM324N would need to be connected to GND/0V but comparing it to Nicola's original design I suspect one of my mistakes was not to connect it to -V but to GND instead, right? I will give it another try later on and post my results....
Cheers!
UPDATE: soldering negative power of the LM324 to -V instead of ground significantly improved the overall performance. Nevertheless the behaviour is not as I would expect from an ADSR. Has anybody had success transfering the values to eurorack-level? I will try to change some resistor values and see if there‘s a difference this week...but some other projects hve also arrived from the UK soooooo they probably will come first.
PERFORMANCE did u end up getting this working with + / - 12v?
ive been toying with this circuit for a few days, trying to get it to work with 12v.
i feel like im close but its not quite there.
my symptoms may be sort of similar to you experience?
the lfo / trigger switch does not work at all :S
most of the pots work as they should, however if i turn the release pot up over about 30% the gate is always open.
i did find an interesting way to modify the attack time by putting the 10uf on a switch with some other cap values (as low as 100nf and as high as 100uf for SUPER slow attack)
PERFORMANCE wrote:
Okay, sorry for the spam - it didn't stop bothering me...from fonik's redrawn schem I assumed the negative pin of the LM324N would need to be connected to GND/0V but comparing it to Nicola's original design I suspect one of my mistakes was not to connect it to -V but to GND instead, right? I will give it another try later on and post my results....
Cheers!
UPDATE: soldering negative power of the LM324 to -V instead of ground significantly improved the overall performance. Nevertheless the behaviour is not as I would expect from an ADSR. Has anybody had success transfering the values to eurorack-level? I will try to change some resistor values and see if there‘s a difference this week...but some other projects hve also arrived from the UK soooooo they probably will come first.
Update 2: HEEEEEEEEEEEEEELP, 12V anyone?
Hey! Nah, I haven't made any progress on this one yet but I'm still eager to solve it. I've recently built a bench supply with breadboard connectivity and might give this a spin on breadboard in the near future. Will keep all of you updated! Meanwhile I did have success on René Schmitz' "Fastest Envelope in the West" which I've built two of - cool!
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum You cannot attach files in this forum You can download files in this forum
Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software
FAQ
Calendar
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
Chat Room
